Warning.

Lite · **I'm lite... and I'm fantastic!**

Warning.

Copper · **Superhero Extraordinaire**

Not sure about anyone else, but I think I might read it now.

-- Edited by Copper at 11:16, 2005-05-05

ddvmor · **I am the Jammie King!**

BLASPHEMER!!!!

How dare you defile the sacred word of... er...

I'm not fooling anyone, am I?

It's true, though. Without trying to start a huge religious debate, there's lots of pretty nasty stuff in the Bible. Mostly done by some pretty nasty characters. But you kinda have to have the 'orrible stuff in there to make the good stuff more meaningful.

As for being a work of fiction... you have to remember that the thing was written at a time when it's audience was not what you could call sophisticated. My own opinion is that stuff like Adam and Eve was an allegory or parable type thing to explain some pretty complex stuff to some pretty simple chaps.

Of course there's also the suggestion around that the Romans re-wrote the thing anyway. Apparently the whole 10 Commandments thing was added in later. Pinch of salt. Chances are we'll never no for sure!

As for books that start wars and kill millions of people.... correct me if I'm wrong, but it ain't books that start wars and kill millions of people... it's a bunch of loony people that do that! I've read the Good Book, and I don't feel the need to start a Crusade!

heh.

Was kinda funny though.

Aodan · Teiam Member

I read an article the other day where that sort of warning would be perfect for the guy they were talking about.

He apparently is going around saying with this group of his that unless you believe in beating your children when they are out of line - then you don't really believe in the bible and you are not a good christian. Though he didn't say whether he believes in stoning his children to death for insubordinate behaviour (yeah that's in there) I hate to think.....

The picture accompanying the article showed him standing there with the special belt he uses to beat his children with.

The child next to him looked broken. Not bruised or anything - just a broken child.

-- Edited by Aodan at 16:12, 2005-05-05

ddvmor · **I am the Jammie King!**

Nasty. I'm all for smacking naughty children, but hitting them with stuff just isn't right.

HaloBurn · **Dad** Yarrr...

Actually I think we should put all that mumbo jumbo to bed, once you realise the process the current New Testement went through when it was compiled in around 400ad you get the picture just how much of a sham it all is.

The un-funny side is that some people take it too seriously , Yec's and creationists being the most funny and most dangerous! Good ol Dubya even said the jury was out in Evolution, rflmao! someone forgot to tell him the jury came back in around 200 years ago in it's favor.

ddvmor · **I am the Jammie King!**

400 AD? Are you sure. Only I thought it was the Romans. Were the Romans still around then?

Anyway.. the obvious point here is... would you hit a child with the New Testament? And if so, which version would you use?

-- Edited by ddvmor at 15:00, 2005-05-06

HaloBurn · **Dad** Yarrr...

I'd use the Beano!

And it was Constantine the Great who had the NT comissioned, he converted the official Roman religion to Christianity (or at least his version of it). Google the council of necea for more info it's funny to think that the "divinity" of Jesus was decided by a vote

JonnyStead · **"I'm Lois!"**

I dont think we should write off stoning children... you dont have to go near them then... just a thought...

NateO · Vice JDK and Man of the People

quote:
Originally posted by: JonnyStead
"I dont think we should write off stoning children... you dont have to go near them then... just a thought..."

Afraid it's not so simple, mate. Take last week's family reunion of sorts: involuntary children infusion!

-- Edited by NateO at 18:42, 2005-05-06

bonniepirateanne · Date: May 6, 2005

well

as a Christian (large intake of breath by bored boarders - uhoh.. ) i think that it's not so much that you're not thinking too much, more that you're not thinking enough.. i'm by no means a bible basher - i believe that God exists.. i believe he sent his son to die on earth and i believe he rose again - i don't believe it should be shoved down the throats of people that dont want to hear it (although you should all take a moment and read some of it if you havent) there are many Christians that give others a bad name, but hey, there are loads of pretty cool Christians about as well

and if you want me to get into the many facts that prove the bibles claims.. i will (many of the prophecies from the early books were fulfilled, archeology proves that many of the evetns did happen and many science things from today (the world is round, gravity exists etc) were also alluded to in the bible years before scientists 'discovered' them)

and as for evolution, i dont believe any jury has ever come back on that one being real - there's a huge gapping hole in it - sure, moths and dogs and whatever adapt to their surroundings, but humans came from apes? show me the missing link and i'll believe you

-- Edited by bonniepirateanne at 18:48, 2005-05-06

ddvmor · **I am the Jammie King!**

Go KT!

Gotta say, I'm with you on this one - I think you missd the last debate a few weeks ago! I ain't anti-Evo, but no-one's ever proven to me conclusively that it's a a better thory than creationism or alien seeding or any other bizzare theory. That said, it kinda makes sense, so I'll go with it as the most likely candidate!

And I'm one of those 'cool christians' you're talking about. I like winding Halo up about it though. Cos I'm a basserd.

Sadly, we can't hit children with evolution. But we can hit them with books about evolution.

Oh... and Nate. My condolences on the children infusion at the weekend.

-- Edited by ddvmor at 19:00, 2005-05-06

NateO · Vice JDK and Man of the People

This guy, Kate?

Thanks JDK, I survived, somehow.

-- Edited by NateO at 19:03, 2005-05-06

ddvmor · **I am the Jammie King!**

Argh. He brought out Roddy!

Sorry KT. We're stuffed now! Ain't no arguing with that!

-- Edited by ddvmor at 19:13, 2005-05-06

bonniepirateanne · Date: May 6, 2005

oh woe it has been proven

NateO · Vice JDK and Man of the People

Argh, er, sorry about that!

NateO · Vice JDK and Man of the People

quote:
"Dear me, what are those things coming out of her nose?"
"Spaceballs!?!"
"Oh **CUCUMBER**, there goes the planet."

Beware the Spaceballs!!!.

http://www.ladyofthecake.com/mel/space/sounds/apes.wav

-- Edited by NateO at 21:49, 2005-05-06

Andromeda · ***Proud House-Owner***

Ok, so every time I hear a debate about evolution/creationism, it reminds me about that annoying billboard I pass on I95 every time I go to Titusville. Well I keep promising a picture, and I keep forgetting to bring my camera. But on my latest trip, I made myself remember the website address and they have a picture of the billboard on their site.

So...

http://www.christiscreator.com/billboard.htm

Now I don't care if your christian, athiest, satanist, whatever. This is still overboard. Add that to the "thank you lord for bringing us George W. Bush and Jeb Bush" billboard around the same area and it's a bit like driving through a church. Personally, I find it a bit intrusive.

ddvmor · **I am the Jammie King!**

French Academy of Science, huh? Tells you all you need to know!

Copper · **Superhero Extraordinaire**

quote:
Originally posted by: bonniepirateanne
" humans came from apes? show me the missing link and i'll believe you"

Just to clarify - we are apes. Its not an argument, that is how we are scientifically classified. And evolution does not suggest we came from other apes (like chimpanzees, gorillas etc), but that we all share a common ancestor, so 5 million years ago there was a species that gave rise to both chimpanzees and humans; and as such, all living primate species are endpoints on a family tree. You don't have to buy it, but it is important to clear up any common confusions.

bonniepirateanne · Date: May 8, 2005

it's not a common 'misconfusion' .. i know there are loads of differing theories on evolution and the ape argument but as far as i can understand it there are actually two classification approaches you can take - one, the linaean (i probably spelled that wrong) which is like the 'family order' and the other the cladist philosophy which is the 'evolutionary order'

with the linaean we are all below the hominiodea rank (the 'ancestor' you speak of) and with the cladist i think there just isn't a separate link for humans and so we are classified directly as apes..

the hominiodea ancestor thing, the idea that you suggested, means we are NOT apes (apes descending from it, so did we, but we're not the same), the cladist means we ARE (we are just lumped into the same category)..

so, presuming that is all correct, it depends on what classification theory you use as to whether or not we are apes

of course, that could all be rubbish

ddvmor · **I am the Jammie King!**

I'm pretty ape like. Heavy brow, low forehead, knuckles scraping the floor as I walk. I can also pick my nose with many of my toes.

Er.

Did I just say that aloud?

Susan · Tickle me, Elmo! I'm Roger Moore's Stunt Double!

It's OK Darren. At least you didn't mention your butt crack scratching fetish.

Copper · **Superhero Extraordinaire**

quote:
Originally posted by: bonniepirateanne
"i know there are loads of differing theories on evolution etc etc "

Not sure where you are getting this info from, but we are clearly reading different literature. Modern evolutionary theory does not have the two approaches you describe - they might feature historically but do not influence current research. I feel confident in saying this (and a bit brave..) as I am an evolutionary researcher. Eek! The linnaean classification does change (depending on current understanding of evolutionary processes) and currently, we are classified as apes. Linnaean classification and cladistics are not really in opposition.

Right, off to work now. I think I might have said enough on the bible thread...

-- Edited by Copper at 08:43, 2005-05-09

ddvmor · **I am the Jammie King!**

quote:
Originally posted by: Susan
"It's OK Darren. At least you didn't mention your butt crack scratching fetish. "

At least it's never my own butt-crack.

Susan · Tickle me, Elmo! I'm Roger Moore's Stunt Double!

quote:
Originally posted by: ddvmor
" At least it's never my own butt-crack. "

I'm looking forward to tomorrow evening...

bonniepirateanne · Date: May 9, 2005

quote:
Originally posted by: Copper
"
I am an evolutionary researcher.

eep. i thought you were a policeperson

well i'm not a researcher of much, maybe cheap plane tickets, but that's not really relevant.

i'll believe you on the classification thing, just because a year ago or so i saw a pic of darren and really it's undeniable

Copper · **Superhero Extraordinaire**

Indeed. Darren is evidence enough.

ddvmor · **I am the Jammie King!**

Pff.

That's it. just 'Pff'.

Susan · Tickle me, Elmo! I'm Roger Moore's Stunt Double!

Does your honour need defending, King?

I'm sure I could find someone...might take some time though