Want to defend yourself but can't buy a gun 'cos your not in America ...

Henglegert Rinkerdink · Sorry... I must have the wrong street.

Want to defend yourself but can't buy a gun 'cos your not in America ...

Truckman · Old. But wise!

Interesting, but I'm used to carrying my .45 everywhere I go...I'll stay with what works for me... wink ...Ben

Henglegert Rinkerdink · Sorry... I must have the wrong street.

If I could ... I would ... furious

Truckman · Old. But wise!

Henglegert Rinkerdink wrote:
If I could ... I would ...

Not to sound like a revolutionary, but maybe it's time to take back your own freedom from those who don't want you to have it...Just a thought......Ben

sha76jam · Cpt Acorn Short of An Oaktree

I'm glad not to have guns readily available personally (though lego guns v cool, & so much easier to dispose of the evidence). I figure if someone comes after me with a knife, or their fists, or a dog then at least I have an outside chance of defending myself or running away, with a gun I'm reduced to hoping they're a muppet & forgot to put the bullets in.

Aodan · Teiam Member

sha76jam wrote:
I'm glad not to have guns readily available personally (though lego guns v cool, & so much easier to dispose of the evidence). I figure if someone comes after me with a knife, or their fists, or a dog then at least I have an outside chance of defending myself or running away, with a gun I'm reduced to hoping they're a muppet & forgot to put the bullets in.

This ^^

ddvmor · **I am the Jammie King!**

Truckman wrote:
.....

Why does this smilie worry me so much?

Truckman · Old. But wise!

ddvmor wrote:
Truckman wrote:
.....
Why does this smilie worry me so much?

I don't know...You're the one that included it in the smilie list and named it "teamwork"...You tell us...

In the meantime, here is an article giving one view on the sad happenings in London...I'm not trying to tell you that Americans are any better off or even safer than Brits because we have fewer gun control restrictions...I'm just pointing out that we have the choice of arming ourselves or not...

Is it possible that some of you feel safer than Americans simply because you've been told that you're safer for so long that you've begun to believe it?...In my estimation, disarming law-abiding people only makes the lawbreakers safer......Ben

ddvmor · **I am the Jammie King!**

I'm very sorry, Ben. I got as far as the Daily Mail mention and had to stop. Unfortunately, quoting the Daily Mail is a bit like bringing up the Nazis in an internet discussion.

Damn... I fell onto my own point...

Truckman · Old. But wise!

I knew the Mail would probably be a point killer but it was not my idea to use it as a reference...However, I think the article itself has merits for discussion......Ben

ddvmor · **I am the Jammie King!**

The whole thing kicked off when someone got shot.

Also, someone should tell the writer that 'disarmed' does not mean the same as 'unarmed', except when you're trying to create a false sense of righteous indignation in your article.

Truckman · Old. But wise!

ddvmor wrote:
Also, someone should tell the writer that 'disarmed' does not mean the same as 'unarmed', except when you're trying to create a false sense of righteous indignation in your article.

Bear in mind that those who were "disarmed" were done so by those who stayed armed...The "false sense of righteous indignation" might only be seen from a false sense of security into which one has been lulled by the disarmers...

I look at the right to keep and bear arms not as strictly an American right guaranteed by a piece of paper, but more as a human right guaranteed by a benevolent God...The same God who granted us self-determination, including whether to believe in his benevolence or not...

I'll also grant you the right to believe you don't need a means to protect your other rights even to the point where the last of them is denied to you... wink ...Ben

ddvmor · **I am the Jammie King!**

Guns are not the only way to protect my rights and I don't need to be granted the right to believe that cos I already have that right.

In my line of work, I'm VERY aware of exactly how 'secure' I am and don't need any lulling.

America is a very different beast to Britain. For a start, your petty crooks and thugs have guns. Ours have very thick skulls and not a lot else. I'm not saying that guns breed gun crime. Criminals breed gun crime. I'd just as soon not make it easier for our lot to get hold of them. We get by okay.

And didn't you get the memo? The right to bear arms actually meant this.

Family Guy for the win! Woohoo!

sha76jam · Cpt Acorn Short of An Oaktree

& if the gun laws were relaxed, who do you think would be the first ones out to buy them? I'm betting on the ones doing the rioting. It's not merely a difference in law between the US & the UK, it's also a big difference in culture.

Truckman · Old. But wise!

ddvmor wrote:
I'm not saying that guns breed gun crime. Criminals breed gun crime. I'd just as soon not make it easier for our lot to get hold of them. We get by okay.

You got that one right...But criminal acts and their prevention or allowance is only one aspect of gun ownership rights...I don't want criminals to have access to anything that could be used against me...But denying them to law-abiding citizens is not the way to do it...They also use cars, Wrangler jeans, bacon and lawyers in the commission of crimes...Should we ban all that too?...

Well, banning lawyers might be okay...I'm not asking you to change your laws to suit me; I'm just suggesting you might have cut off your nose to protect your face...Security might have a price, but freedom is too much to pay......Ben

ddvmor · **I am the Jammie King!**

Bacon crime?

Truckman · Old. But wise!

ddvmor wrote:
Bacon crime?

If eating bacon can keep a criminal alive long enough to commit another crime, then shouldn't bacon be banned?......Ben

ddvmor · **I am the Jammie King!**

I'm confused. Is the choice bacon or guns? I choose bacon over guns any day.

I wonder if you could build a gun out of bacon! Or a gun that fires bacon!

Truckman · Old. But wise!

ddvmor wrote:
I'm confused. Is the choice bacon or guns? I choose bacon over guns any day.

I wonder if you could build a gun out of bacon!

-- Edited by ddvmor on Saturday 13th of August 2011 11:26:46 PM

Preventing ownership of either one and expecting it to stop crime is an exercise in futility...That was my point...

Tomorrow morning I'll have my usual five slices of bacon (crisp) as part of my usual breakfast while my .45 is in its usual place on the nightstand...I wouldn't advise trying to take either one from me......Ben

ddvmor · **I am the Jammie King!**

At least we agree on the important issues.

Aodan · Teiam Member

This is just my opinion, but guns make it far too easy to kill people. It takes the thought out of it. If you're going to stab someone, you need to be close - you need to see their face. With a gun all you need to do is squeeze a trigger.

I don't like them and will never own one.

Bacon on the other hand.. there's nothing wrong with bacon.

sha76jam · Cpt Acorn Short of An Oaktree

Ben, on your logic we need to ban food and air.

Truckman · Old. But wise!

sha76jam wrote:
Ben, on your logic we need to ban food and air.

Somebody finally made the connection...I've been trying to show the ridiculousness of blaming guns, or cars, or lawn sprinklers, or any other blameless inanimate object for the acts of criminals...It's illogical...Get rid of the criminal, not an otherwise useful tool...

I'm not saying you should have a gun in your house if you don't want one, any more than I should be forced to have a Johnny Depp poster on my wall if I don't want one...If cars are banned because they make it convenient for criminals to come to your neighborhood for their crimes, they'll take the bus or ride horses to get there...

Guns have many uses beyond the narrow scope of offense or defense...They are used for sport, admired for their aesthetic and historical qualities, lend a platform for technical advances and, in my case, provided a way of making a living for myself and many others...

When criminals send you a message of violence and greed, they won't stop just because you take the means of sending messages away from the law-abiding public...

Thank you for making my point......Ben

sha76jam · Cpt Acorn Short of An Oaktree

Woah, did you miss my point! Food & air are basic human rights. The right to bear arms is part of the American constitution. You see the difference? Just to be clear, car driving, jeans owning, sprinkler usage, bacon eating and the display of Johnny Depp posters (should you really feel the need) are not human rights.

Truckman · Old. But wise!

Ownership of anything that suits a person is a basic human right...With that right to ownership comes the responsibility of using it without harm to others and safeguarding it against misuse...I don't care where on the planet you stand, no one should have the power to tell another what he or she can own if that person can accept the responsibility that goes with ownership... blankstare ...Ben

sha76jam · Cpt Acorn Short of An Oaktree

Thank you, in one sentence you have made me anti capitalist. No, basic human rights have no ownership requirements.

ddvmor · **I am the Jammie King!**

Hang on... eating bacon isn't a basic human right? Shit. The world is a really sucky place!

Oh, and for the record...

Truckman wrote:
Somebody finally made the connection...

Someone made it ages ago. Someone really clever and wise (and handsome):

Truckman wrote:
ddvmor wrote:
I'm not saying that guns breed gun crime. Criminals breed gun crime.
You got that one right...

And then he returned the conversation back to the important issues:

ddvmor wrote:
I wonder if you could build a gun out of bacon! Or a gun that fires bacon!

Lets focus on the bacon, people.

Truckman · Old. But wise!

sha76jam wrote:
No, basic human rights have no ownership requirements.

Are you then saying that no person has a right to be secure in and with his own property?...

sha76jam · Cpt Acorn Short of An Oaktree

I'm saying safety is a basic human right, the right to property ownership, no.

Truckman · Old. But wise!

I couldn't tell, was that a "yes" or a "no?"...