The following Dodgers have been smited by the JDK for their crimes against Jam:
All the girls! for picking on the JDK and damaging his already delicate self esteem!
The Basserd Who Nicked Copper's Stuff For the offense of nicking Copper's stuff. You are a tw*t, whoever you are and we all hope you get run over by a tram in Nottingham. Or Liverpool. Or whereever else they have trams!
Copper For the crime of playing with her Wii instead of her Jammie pals!
I just asked Natalia if she knows what the Holy Ghost or Holy Spirit is and she hasn't a clue. She said, and I quote "I haven't heard of a holey anything".
Must admit that I find the notion of Religios education in schools a bit of a funny one, fine if it's kept solely to the RE class where all Religions are taught without bias.
But given the recent upsurge in some very dodgy organisations getting involved with education especially when there are some very suspect activities going on I am very concerned about what we allow the upcoming generations to be force fed.
For example if you look into the Vardy foundation and Emmanuel academy's it's pretty plain to see something is very very wrong i.e. they teach homosexuality is a gross sin and what christian creation myths taught in Science alongside Evolution! Very wrong and very very suspect.
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I aint no wide eyed rebel, but I aint no preachers son.
quote: Originally posted by: HaloBurn "...and what christian creation myths taught in Science alongside Evolution! Very wrong and very very suspect..."
Science deals with observation and facts, Religion deals with Faith; faith has no provable facts it's just what it says on the tin Faith.
Evolution is an observed fact, the theory of evolution through natural selection is a theory that best fits the observed facts of many different branches of Science.
Some Christians accept this and that's fine they are free to follow their Faith, however there are those who would corrupt the young and attempt to have Creationism taught in Science classes which is very wrong, some of the worst are YEC's or Young Earth Christians who think the Earth is only 6000 years old! It's funny but they argue their Faith into science based arguments and have more or less turned God into some kind of "God of the gaps" where whenever they see a gap in scientific knowladge they insert God.
Funny but true.
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I aint no wide eyed rebel, but I aint no preachers son.
Actually, I think there is a valid reason to have creationism taught in schools alongside evolution. Now (despite what Copper will tell you) I don't subscribe to creationism, but it does raise some interesting points around the acceptance of scientific 'knowledge' as fact.
Almost all scientific knowledge appears to actually be theories. Evolution is one, dark matter, the big bang theory, sub-atomic particle thory, black holes and so-on are others. Because we're unable to pysically observe such things directly with our own eyes, we're forced to hypothesize about them and make assumptions based on what we know.
We know evolution happens as it has been observed over a short period - animal breeding and that thing Darwin had with the birds on whatever island it was. Whilst we can theorize and extrapolate about the effect of millions of years of evolution, without actually observing it over that period, it remains just that - a theory.
Now. Fossils. This is a good bit. Fossils can be formed really really quickly. It doesn't take millions of years. Mother Shipton's Cave in Yorkshire, where teddy bears are suspended from the cave ceiling and converted to fossils over the course of a couple of years by the limey stuff is an example of this. And we know that when Mount St Helen's blew in 1980 (ish) it formed rock formations in an afternoon which, when pictures and samples were examined by geologists were declared millions of years old. So potentially, fossils which appear to be millions of years old, could in fact only be a few thousand.
Now, I accept that evolution over millions of years is a far more sensible and credible theory than a 6000-10000 year old planet but (and it's probably the job I do that makes me think like this) I'm suspicious of anything that cannot be proven with rock solid hard evidence.
So my point... finally. Alternative theories should be taught on the basis that it allows schoolchildren the opportunity to think for themselves and choose which theories to believe - and not to just accept that one theory is correct because the teacher says so.
Yarrr.
(Copper's gonna rip me to shreds now... I just know it...)
We should keep this light, in fact given that it takes billions of years for distant star light to reach us travelling at light speed would suggest that the universe is much much older than a few thousand years. Erosion, red shift and arctic deep core ice samples also negate a young earth.
As for fossils it the layers of rock at which they are found together with other dating methodes which tell us the age.
Like I said Science in the Science class, no probs with creation in the RE class.
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I aint no wide eyed rebel, but I aint no preachers son.
Did I mention that your username looks like HaloBUM? Which clearly discredits anything you have to say, Pirate Boy!
Nope, I agree with what you're saying there (except the erosion bit - doesn't prove a thing - see Mt St Helens again). All I'm saying is that I cannot observe these things in action and, without getting myself a PhD or 3, I'm expected to simply accept Darwin, Einstein, Hawkings and all those other clever boff's word for it without question. Kinda like Catholocism (which I'm allowed to say without fear of reprisal cos I am one!).
Kids in school should be taught not to simply accept the word of those in 'authority' and to question unproven 'facts'. otherwise, what's the difference between us and the other apes (apart from the ability to make asymmetric facial expressions)?
I am keeping a low profile, I come here to avoid work and enjoy being lazy and you guys are trying to make me work!
tsk tsk
ps I just wrote this sentence in my manuscript ...as a species we have evolved streamlined mechanisms to perceive...just in case you were worried I am not an evolutionist but, in fact, God.
Kids should be taught not accept things on face value and question things, perception is reality and everyone has their own belief systems that are very difficult to change. I just happen to think that you teach Science in a Science class. Or if we teach Faith based alternatives we should teach all from Christian to American Indian as they are all just as valid as each other.
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I aint no wide eyed rebel, but I aint no preachers son.
quote: Originally posted by: ddvmor " I don't subscribe to creationism, but it does raise some interesting points around the acceptance of scientific 'knowledge' as fact... I'm suspicious of anything that cannot be proven with rock solid hard evidence. "
Ok. If BigMouth is offering his words of wisdom, then I have no choice but to dissect them.
Let us muse over the above statement.
1. In simple terms, what does creationism actually offer to the scientific debate? Notice Big has not posited a convincing alternative to evolution, merely damned the evidence behind it. Sounds a bit like the tories, ahem, cough (listening Santa?)
2. Let us assume the alternative is that God made the world. Rock solid hard evidence please.
This actually brings up an interesting debate for me, purely because I don't live far from the Bible Belt (and some people might actually include my town in it).
I'm an evolution gal, but I can tell you by the number of Jesus fish on the back of people's cars, most people around here are not. I never had a problem with teaching creationism in schools, but more as a theory and not "this is the way it is. Believe it or burn in hell!" like most schools around here do. There is something quite scary about living in an area where you can drive past 13 or 14 religious schools without trying, but have to seek out public schools.
But one thing I find ridiculously scary is this:
A few times per month I have to drive about an hour north to go to the local courthouse for documents (a work thing) and on my way there is a billboard on the most main highway in Florida that says "Evolution is a fairy tale for adults". It's a little freaky. I'll have to get a picture of it the next time I go.
Wouldn't be the same state that put stickers on science book saying "Evolution is a just theory" almost choked when I recently read that on official tours of the grand canyon the tour guids said that the canyon was created by the flood of Noah! Ha Ha Ha
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I aint no wide eyed rebel, but I aint no preachers son.
Kids (large and small) should be given the theories and left alone to choose.
Black and white do not exist, everything is a shade of grey.
reminds me of the unanswerable question:
'have you stopped beating your wife?'
BTW the 6,000 year old earth theory was deduced by an Irish Bishop, who basically counted up all the people in the Bible, worked out who was begat of who, assigned an average age to them and came up with 6,000 or so. Logical, oui?
Or if we teach Faith based alternatives we should teach all from Christian to American Indian as they are all just as valid as each other. 
